Ep105 Marnie Stockman & Nick Coniglio - Leadership Is Life: Why Self-Leadership Matters More Than Your Job Title

Marnie Stockman  0:00  
To follow the set framework around leadership will allow you to be successful in any portion of your life, and it is what led us. Thank you. Danny Rojas and Ted lasso to our main theme of the book, which is leadership is life, and it doesn't just happen in a board room, but it could happen in a locker room, a classroom and the living room.

Jason Croft  0:22  
Welcome to strategy in action, where we reveal how industry leaders build real market gravity, the force that naturally attracts opportunities, partnerships and profits. You get raw insights, proven frameworks and strategies that actually move the needle in your business. Let's get started. Marty Stockman and Nick niglia are on the show today, and we have a blast talking through a bunch of their book lead it like lasso. And they've taken this concept, you know, in this inspiration from the show Ted lasso, and really formulated leadership style and lessons, and this book around them, and it's, it's really a fun way to do that and bring it through, you know, a lot of these important leadership topics, but it also helps. It helps just ground them and implant them. Just like telling a story gets a point to stick more that we remember it when we can attach it to these characters and these story lines that we've grown to love over the last few years, it really helps them stick. And we just have a we have a blast. I had the great honor to be on their show, and it was so much fun to have them on strategy and action as well. We've got a new book now called the business of you. We touch on that just a little bit towards the end. It's now been released, so jump out there and grab that and sit back and enjoy this episode with Marnie and Nick. You. Good morning and Nick welcome

Nick Coniglio  2:04  
to the show. Thanks for having us happy to be here.

Jason Croft  2:08  
Oh yeah, this is gonna be fun, if nothing else, if we don't teach anybody anything, we don't inform anything, it's gonna be a fun conversation. Now, perfect. I have quite the feeling that we're gonna do all three of those things, but it's gonna be fun nonetheless. So I'm excited you're both here. Oh, we're excited as well. Yeah, Marty, you and I had a chance to to connect on a call beforehand. Yes, and it really that's why I know this is gonna be fun, right? Because we dug in on a lot of commonalities here, we should have recorded that exactly amount of times. You think I would learn by now, if I were a professional and knew what I was doing, I would, I would do such things. But here we are, so I really want to dive in with the two of you specifically on this idea of leadership. This show, we talk to a lot of coaches consultants, for an audience of coaches and consultants, and whether they're building their business or they're helping their clients out better. And I think quite a few embrace this idea. I don't think, I don't think anybody's like, man, you don't need leadership. No, what's that for? But at the same time, I think, because it's such an important topic and so talked about that, it goes into a gray zone, a little bit of just, you know, just it passes by buzz wording, and, yeah, it really is. And so I want to tackle two main things today. One is why this actually really does matter for everyone to stop and go. Okay, let me think about this word and how it plays out in my life. But secondly, who that does apply to and in what role is it only C suite executives? Is it the mom at home, running her household? Is it everyone, no one, everywhere in between? So those are the big life concepts we're gonna we're gonna

Marnie Stockman  4:21  
solve that up in just a couple minutes. Yeah, exactly you got about what are we going to talk about for the other 28 minutes?

Jason Croft  4:28  
Jason, exactly. I think 36 seconds on this, and then we're done. I think so give us some context. So give us some geography. Certainly on your book, lead it like lasso. That's, of course, what spurred this idea to have the two of you on for this conversation, but, but each of you give me some some background, and give the audience a background of where you come into this space, and make it obvious why I've brought you both on to talk about this, this idea both from knowledge. All of it, but just love your insights already.

Marnie Stockman  5:03  
Yeah, I think you know, you asked one of the questions was, why this actually matters, right? And then the other one was who it applies to. So I think between our backgrounds, this will get you a good coverage of where we are thinking. So I was a high school math teacher, administrator, stay at home. Mom owned a knitting shop as a side gig for a bit before I started leaving customer success at the company where Nick worked. So I'll stop there and let him catch you up to that point, and then we'll go from there.

Nick Coniglio  5:36  
Yeah. Well, I was, I was, my background is, I was a computer programmer. I was that that guy in the closet drinking 14 cokes a day, didn't want to talk to anybody. But then I got into consulting, and I figured out, you know what, you actually have to interface with human beings to to kind of get ahead in in this, in this world, you don't have to, but it sure surely helps. But long story short, I'd worked my way up, and I had a knack for working for companies, and kind of I started well, I was in leadership positions a lot. I was on a lot of executive leadership teams, specifically for companies that ended up having really significant growth, and going through an exit and acquisition, the third of which of those companies was where I started working with Marnie. It was, it is the largest ed tech company in the world these days, but we had gone through a point where we kept getting acquired and acquired and acquired, and it was a struggle. You know, at some point, for those familiar we've loaded wrote a book about Ted lasso, but in the show, there's a character who is a villain, Rupert Manion, who was that command and control dictator type boss. And what we ultimately realized was that there was such a significant disconnect between the core values, the stated core values of the company, and the culture, and actually how it played out that we decided to take a risk and do something about it, and I'm gonna tag Marnie. You're it, you're back into the game.

Marnie Stockman  7:16  
So So neither of us are risk takers by nature. So you know, there was a bad culture clash for us to decide that we were going to leave, you know, a secure, stable, well paying job to go out on our own. Because we were in the largest ed tech company in the world, we had a non compete that pretty much said you can work any place but education for the next three to five years. Good luck. So we, like Ted lasso, went to a space that was entirely different than where we had been. We started scaled and sold a company in the same three years that Ted lasso aired. And as folk folks asked, like, how did you do that? You didn't even know what MSP stood for. I thought it meant Maryland state police, but we actually built software for managed service providers. You know, how did you do that? In three years? And as Nick and I looked back on Clearly, our very varied backgrounds, we realized that the same thing that had made our company successful as what had made me successful in a classroom, in a knitting shop, what made Nick successful in not a server room, but, you know, in a in a dark coding room and in leadership rooms, and that that framework is really what makes leadership important, because there is to follow the set framework around leadership will allow you to be successful in any portion of your life, and it is what led us. Thank you. Danny Rojas and Ted lasso to our main theme of the book, which is leadership, is life, and it doesn't just happen in a board room, but it could happen in a locker room, a classroom and a living room. So that's that's how we got from there to there. There's a lot of details in between, but that'll give you a head start.

Jason Croft  9:00  
I love it. I love it. And we'll certainly get into the book. And that the what just spurred that and like, hey, this needs to be a book, and you're in all of it. But if anybody here watching is like, what are they talking about? Ted lasso, I haven't watched that yet. Well, that's your first step. That's the first thing wrong

Marnie Stockman  9:21  
number one, and it's a great leadership professional development. So we're not just saying this. We don't work for Apple TV. We don't need your subscription dollars. We don't get them exactly.

Jason Croft  9:32  
And it's just, yeah, I don't know what to if you don't want to watch it, I can't help you. So you'll never be a leader. How about that? We'll just say that for scripting, no, but you'll, you'll hear us referencing that because it is phenomenal, and I want to bring this bridge in what prompted it. But first, this idea with your backgrounds, and as you started. Connect those dots like you mentioned Marnie of what were these commonalities in this idea of leadership? Give me some specifics though on what, what were those dots that connected that actually brought it up to like, oh, it was leadership in some way that allowed us to be as successful as we were.

Marnie Stockman  10:24  
So we always like to say that counter examples are great examples, right? They It is sometimes easy to follow along a happy path, but it's harder to project it for yourself in a different arena, whereas a counter example in media is like that is not what we're going to do. And Nick mentioned that when we, the company we worked for, got acquired, it was leadership that had really set the tone and the culture of the company as it does, right? And they would say things like, we're all about customer success. Well, I ran customer success, and they cut half my staff. Nick ran customer support. I believe they cut 30 at least percent of his staff to start right, and so we were no longer able to do the things that we were passionate about, doing, supporting and serving our customers right. So when Nick and I started talking about, maybe we should leave and start our own company. The first thing Nick said is we already know how we'll run it right. It won't feel like this. We will run it so that our core values are felt and actually delivered through the company. So in terms of leadership elements, it was very obvious to us that the places where we had been successful in our individual jobs were when our own core values aligned with our work and the output of the company, the culture the company didn't have to be the same. It just had our work had to align with that culture, and that when those things weren't aligned, it was disastrous. So I think that is how we knew that core values would be the number one element of what we wanted to talk about when it came to leadership. Nick What say you on that? Get any of that backwards? Never.

Nick Coniglio  12:14  
She never does. It's always, it's always spot on. No, I would, I would agree with that. And I think, you know one of the things that is, is we talk about a lot, right? First of all, you open the show you talked about leadership, right? For us, we very much couch it from the standpoint of personal leadership. How do I lead myself? Because, because you don't you. It's really hard, if not impossible, to lead others, whether it's a small team or large team, unless you lead yourself first. And Marty mine mentioned the core values, understanding what drives you. The other thing we talk a lot about, and we can't take credit for this, Adam Grant actually coined it in one of his books, think again, where he talked about the character revolution, right? It's, it's bit ironic. We're in 2025 when everybody is talking about technology, AI doing all the work, right? But what? What really allows individuals to stand out and differentiate themselves? And this hasn't changed in the last 40 years, 30 years that I've been, you know, a professional. It's the character skills, it's the soft skills, it's understanding, you know, how to see things from somebody else's perspective, how to communicate with people, how to be vulnerable, right? Because that elicits trust. And that's, you know, Marnie. Marnie talked about, you know, a very important and the thing we lead off with in our book, which is understanding yourself core values, but, but we also get into, you know, the softer skills, you know, emotional intelligence, vulnerability, empathy, all those types of things which ultimately lead to trust, which, which is really the foundation of what we would call leadership.

Jason Croft  14:08  
Yeah, I love that concept, and it's so important and critical. And I think that idea of self leadership you it's everything starts there and ends there, yeah, like, like, you can't fully do anything without owning that first, leading yourself first, but then you've got to get back to this congruency with your core values. You have to lead yourself all along the way as you go down that path. And I think that's the point you're making with this core values again. How many times have we heard from LinkedIn, you know, you should lead. You should define your core values. You should, you know, great, and they get stuck on a wall and but how do you dig in and know what your core values are? Take that time this. Decide on that and then, like you say, live by that every

Marnie Stockman  15:05  
day well, and those are two different things, right? Like identifying them is one thing, then figuring out how they play out in your life is entirely different thing. So Harvard Business Review research says number one indicator of leadership success is self awareness. So if you needed another argument as to why you should figure out your core values, like, there you go. That wasn't us saying it. That was Harvard Business Review, but you said something really important is to take the time to reflect, because that is what it takes to think about your core values and think about, really, what motivates you and demotivates you, because sometimes the opposite of that, demotivation is So case in point, I hate filling out online forms with a white hot passion and and you wouldn't think, well, clearly, that's an important core value. But if you think about why I hate doing that? It's slow, it's tedious, right? It feels like I'm wasting time. The opposite of that is being productive, which is a core value of mine, right? But when I know that, first, I don't ever apply for jobs that have me filling out expense reports ad nauseam. So you have to think about, if productivity is your core value, how does that play out in the work you want to do, you love to do, and you're passionate about, and that's what you said in like, how it plays out in the day to day. So Nick and I talk about the core values is, you know how you like your belief system and the cultures, how it plays out in behaviors.

Nick Coniglio  16:42  
And then I think just tagging onto that, I think you bring up something really important, Jason, which is, you know, we wanted to avoid, not just, you know, stating and stating the obvious that like you see on the LinkedIn post, which is, all right, you have to identify your core values, right? We we like we are adamant about, okay, and this is how you might do it. In our, in our book, in our, in our next initiative that we're working on, we're all about trying to provide, you know, shortcuts to and fun ways, fun shortcuts on how to identify those things, whether it's through Mad Libs, a Mad Libs types act type activity. You know, we have one that's that's part fun, part part morbid. We talk a lot about the importance of legacy and and the fact that legacy, you know, thinking about legacy and projecting your legacy really acts as as bumper pads to actions you take on a daily basis. But a lot of people don't want to think about their legacy, legacy. So we say, Okay, well, think about writing a letter on the day you retire, and what that might look like with we a little bit more bib. We think about writing your obituary, but it's important to give people the tools and the ideas and the brainstorming, not that we have them all by any stretch of the imagination, but on how to actually take action, to start to build and have an easier way to self reflect on how you're actually doing in kind of making progress towards personal development. I love that,

Jason Croft  18:20  
because that was exactly where I was going to go with that. And not to get too deep on, you know, number one here, but I think that's what I love in your approach here, is that it isn't just, yeah, go figure them out. It's, let's dig in and not only wait, stop everybody. This is an important step number one, okay, how do I do that? And, and I'm fascinated with that, that process on how to really do that, to sit there with a blank page and go, What do I like? What do I not love? Yeah, can be daunting, right? To find that fun way. I've got a good friend and coach of another show Gary de Rodriguez, and he put me through a brutal process of discovering my down top five values. And it goes from list out 50, take it to 25 take it to but then and then, as you're going to he gets about that, that 20, he starts putting them against each other, yeah, yeah. And it's just like, oh, man, you gotta

Marnie Stockman  19:33  
pick up between children, like, but I like

Jason Croft  19:36  
them both exactly, and it's so there's brutal ways to do it, though I do recommend it's great on the outside, but then there's fun math, and I love just this, I don't know, just this help, right? Like, for the folks out there who's like, yes, I want to do this. I want to be better at this. How the heck do I? And I can tell. Already that both from the upcoming or is it blue? Is that the app coming up?

Marnie Stockman  20:05  
Yeah?

Jason Croft  20:06  
And the business of you is the book, yeah, yeah. It's just you guys are digging into really help folks get beyond this idea of just, yeah, you should go do this, dig into it.

Marnie Stockman  20:20  
You know, you talked about leadership being this generic word, right? And I think a lot of people go into jobs, especially corporate enterprise jobs, thinking leadership is other than themselves. Oddly enough, just this morning on Reddit, which, as we know, hates everything and everybody, somebody asked why I should write a legacy plan, and like, Nick and I clearly think that's really important. It's a great way to establish some guide rails for yourself. And and the comments just, I'm like, Oh, my, these poor people. But some of them were like, I'm just barely surviving. Who has time for legacy? I don't care about it. Like it was really, of course, a lot of negative stuff and and I was shocked that those folks didn't see themselves as a leader, or leading anything important, or leaving anything important behind, and then other people would try to correct them and say, like, you're you're here on this earth, you are leaving a legacy. And what do you want that to be for your family or, you know, and they only saw it like they saw leadership as just something for other, whereas, I think what you just said, it's every single person needs to figure that out for themselves, because they do have to lead themselves first.

Jason Croft  21:35  
Yeah, and I guess just in thinking about this idea this morning, is it, is it okay for someone to just like I don't want to be I want to show up somewhere and tell me what to do in just saying that. It's interesting, because just saying the words right? And I think most people would feel this way, even if they're acting that way and operating that way, like you said, I'm just trying to get through the day to say the words. I just want to be a follower. Oh my gosh, does anybody?

Nick Coniglio  22:12  
Maybe they do. I Well, I think people I, you know, I think I subscribed to that when I was younger, especially, right? You know, I don't, because the whole notion I'm an introvert by nature, and the whole notion of, you know, leader in my mind was, you know, having to interact with other people. I'm like, I don't want to do that. I just want follow. But, but again, we want to, we want to change the conversation. You know, everyone is a leader. You know you can, you? Can lead yourself? You have to lead yourself. You know, followers are important Absolutely. But you know what? I may be a follower at work, but I'm a leader because I'm a father at home, and even at work, you may find yourself, and I think we have studies. It's like 76% of of some demographic, I think it was a UK based study right Marnie are they were accidental leaders where they had no intention or desire to be a leader. They had no formal leadership training, but yet they found themselves in a position where they were they were leading others. So you know, whether you like it or not, you are going to lead something. At minimum, you are going to lead yourself. You made you lead yourself very poorly. And I think at the end of the day, as an example, right, if you are someone who has a core value of, I don't know creativity and you are living a life where you're just being told what to do with no imagination, no creativity, and you're following. You may be happy that you're following, but you know what? You're stressed. You're anxious, because whenever you're leading a life where the culture is playing out different than the way you are wired internally, it doesn't work out. It never does.

Jason Croft  24:10  
Yeah, I and I think that's, I think that's, that's the answer, right, honestly, is that is that no matter where you fall on the spectrum, and we all dance between them. We're leading here, like you mentioned, we're leading in this role, and we're following someone else. We're doing those things. And that's, I think that's an important nuance too to talk about, right, that we dance through all of these. But I think the answer there too is, at bare minimum, being in this world, you have to embrace this idea of self leadership, if, if nothing else, and you don't want to lead another soul to because to me, that is hand in hand with ownership and aging. Exact opposite of that is it's all somebody else's fault. It's all. All the government, it's all this. That's why things aren't working out, or that they are, you know, and it's so both empowering you talk about your health and all of that, and my goodness, attracting and energetic and everything, to have that ownership. Like, maybe I didn't directly causes, but I'm going to take ownership of it. What could I do better to take a different direction? And I think that's the answer, which I love, Nick is that at the minimum, that's a requirement. Like to take that on is important. So let's get into the book, because I want to bridge this, and we have, and we've talked about it, but I really want to dig into, like, really specifically on lead it, like, last week, because it is so captivating. And, you know, for the fans out there and in all of that that you just see the cover, and you're like, Oh yeah, that makes sense. You just instant, right? Like, of course, there would be this, but different from just, I don't know, taking something of like, the character says this, and the character says, you're both approaching this, and you're bridging this world, this amazing concept and and writing and everything that's gone into the show with these real world and your own experiences and your own leadership into these to really bring that out. What was the, what was the birth of this idea and concept and and where you're taking it beyond just the book?

Nick Coniglio  26:37  
Well, it helps that Marnie is the real life at TED. Blasphemous. Now, I mean, I, I was watching the show. My son played competitive soccer, so we started watching it during the pandemic, and I'm watching, I'm like, gosh, something, something is familiar about this show. Not only did I love the show, but something was familiar about it, and the way Ted leads with positivity, his whole notion of wanting to help everyone become the best version of himself, themselves, goofiness, it's it's morning, all wrapped up into into one. So when, after we were very fortunate and very successful to start up that business scale, it, sell it in those three years. You know, we had, we had lots of people come to us, relative, nobodies and and ask us, you know, what was, what was the key to your success, what was the secret to your success? And, you know, I we we probably joked one day, so we should write a book about it. And then, you know, that joke become, what got a little more serious and and the fact that, you know, Marnie is Ted lasso, and I am, I don't know who I am in that show, but I'm, I'm somebody, I guess, but it just, it seemed to make sense. We are avid readers of leadership books. You know, a lot of the stuff we learned are from all the the academic researchers out there. And we love those books, and we love the books about Richard Branson and Oprah Winfrey that are written by these, these people who are just so aspirational, larger than life. Yeah. But we felt like, you know, nobody was really talking to us. You know, is there a way that we can communicate our message in it in a manner that was really relatable, you know, from somebody who really was not an academic research, researcher didn't start up in a business and buy jets and and that's two relative Nobodies, like two relative Nobodies, that's what we say in the book. And that that became lead, it like lasso, which was probably one of the funnest projects, and all the things since then, that that I've ever worked on, because the show was fun, right? And we wanted to have that same exact tone. It's been awesome. So I rambled on there. Marty, what was the what's the real answer to the question that Jason asked?

Marnie Stockman  29:07  
No, I think that is the real answer to the question. I can remember we were talking about it and thinking of like, think about all of the lessons in TED lasso and the quotes, right? We started sort of thinking about all the quotes that they had, and thought like, this is just great fodder. This is not a soccer show. It's half we almost subtitled our book a roadmap at the intersection of self help and leadership. We opted for leadership, a leadership book for life, your life, because we do think of the personal element of it. But so much of what Ted lasso brought to the world was it didn't just bring a show that made people laugh. There are lots of shows that do that. It didn't just make people think. It made people want to be better. I mean, there's a Facebook group of almost 100,000 people that one don't ever reply. NARC, even if somebody brings the same comment to a thread for the 1,000th time, they're kind and generous and they're curious and not judgmental, and like, the show really wanted, like it made people want to be better and become the best versions of themselves. So what a great place to relate to people and to jump off from in writing a book.

Jason Croft  30:25  
I love it, yeah, I know from somebody who was so affected as well. Just, I mean, it mirrored times that I was going through in my life, and just that that's the beautiful thing I love. Hey, this right, the gray, the messy middle that in, I like that in shows, movies, all of that. And so few do them well where it's absolutely the funniest one second and you're in tears the next second. And doing that well, it must well. I mean, I know it's absolutely difficult, but so I think so few things attempt it even right to bring and that's I think that's why it feels so human and real, because it is, it's that heart, it is the messy, it's the highs and lows, and I think that's what makes that's to your point, like you said, so relatable. When you bring in these leadership concepts to it, it's accessible, right? Like you're getting at like, like, aspirational is one thing. But what about us? What about where do I apply this today?

Marnie Stockman  31:40  
Many of us don't have the dreams of being Richard Branson, right? Like I just, I don't plan on jumping from a hot air balloon, or even thinking about jumping from a hot air balloon. I don't want to create a company that is, you know, that I don't need to start my own jet line, like Nick said. So we felt like it was like everybody needs to lead themselves to the best version of their life, not, yeah, we can't all be Richard Branson, and we don't all want to

Jason Croft  32:07  
be Yeah, but that's, this is, this is awesome. I What's, what's next with it? Where did, where have you taken that? Well, I guess, give me feedback too, on just the response from the book, where you've taken it and kind of, what's, what's next on the horizon, as you, as you go, go through this,

Marnie Stockman  32:26  
well, like Roy Kent, we've taken it here, there, and every effing wears or,

Nick Coniglio  32:32  
I mean, we're, we're humble and shocked. I mean, we self published the book. We were, we were told that, you know, if you're doing well, if you, if you sell 1000 copies of the book over the life of the book, and the response has been 40x that. I mean, 40 times that. It's, it's, it's been absolutely amazing. It's, it's the community. I think Marty, if we often say, you know, who had asked us beforehand we would have, I don't know what the response would have been. You know, this is the greatest book I've ever read. You know, some of the reviews, you know, that would have been like, Yes, that's what we're going for. But we got stuff. Our feedback, especially in the reviews, has been so much better it's been, you know, this is relatable. I could actually apply this to my to my life, and that has impacted us more than than almost anything. And the coolest part about the whole process is the opportunity to meet cool people like you. Jason, I mean, we've, we have met so many interesting, cool people that have expanded our horizons. You know, it really bangs on the point that we're leadership geeks, not gurus, and we have learned so much from just interacting with other people, hearing their perspective. It's been great, and it's launched entirely new initiatives that that we're really excited about that are all in the same in the same genre, so to speak. You mentioned a couple earlier, but we've Marna. You want to, I don't know if this is the time to do it, but yeah, sure.

Marnie Stockman  34:16  
Well, in August, we're, we're launching the business of you, which is a book about how the most important project you'll ever work on is you, and how you need to run your life like a business. And that really, like Nick said, has come from we've talked to so many people about success and leading their own life, and what we found is that the successful ones, whether they realize it or not, are running their lives like a business, right? They they are well aware. You know, HR is the MAR is the department that hires and fires people, and they fire them if they don't show up. So they show up for their own lives, right? So if you're your own HR department, are you going to hire yourself? Are you going to fire yourself? Right? And. If you're the head of finance, would you invest in you right there these kinds of questions that people really need to think about as they're looking to become their best version. Like, how if you check in with all the departments of you, how are you doing as a business?

Jason Croft  35:17  
I like that. I like that. What do you say, though, to people who do feel the that feels when I think business, I think cold, analytical, this, why would I run my life that way? What's that? What's that response?

Marnie Stockman  35:35  
So, you know, the world talks about personal branding all the time, right? And which companies do they do business with? I mean, in the business world, you hear all of the time people don't do people with businesses. They do business with people that they know, like and trust, right? So I think if you really dig into the companies that fare well, which companies do you love, if you see a commercial and you love their personality, who doesn't love when Wendy has has a snarky Twitter comment on, you know to someone else, right? What commercials Do you remember from the Super Bowl? Right? The ones that tell a story, that make you feel something, and if you think of yourself as a business in that way, you need to learn to tell your story, because to stand out in this digitized world where it's a character revolution, you need to understand, what is your company core value? What is your company story? And that's not a cold thing, right? Business done right feels good because it's doing good for you, and, you know, and for itself. So I think that would be my first statement of it. Nick, how would you? How would you combat that?

Nick Coniglio  36:39  
Yeah, I mean, I think, I mean, I definitely see where you're coming from. Jason, we've heard that quite honestly, but I think it's important to point out where we're, we're talking about something that's radically personal, right? It's your values, it's your purpose, it's your unique gifts, it's your story, it's how you lead with intention. You know, it's it's, it means learning to manage your time like capital. It's developing your personal brand with authenticity. It's building a life that reflects what matters to you most and and in reality, the most successful businesses out there, you know, are ones that that come closest to that. And we, we, we are just using the model of the business to check in with the different departments to go through, you know, how to lead all of your life with intention. And we use the metaphor of the business departments to do that.

Jason Croft  37:43  
Well, yeah. And just to clarify, too, I love that. I don't think of business. I love business into my Yeah. I mean, since I was three years old, I was selling stuff, right? Like, I was just like, I'm a happy capitalist, right? And, yeah, you know, like, and we should all be amazing, wonderful humans to each other. So to me, I dig it. It makes sense. Because correct me, if I'm I'm wrong. But to me, the thesis, there is more that we logically understand. Oh, if we had a business, or if I do, I should make that successful. I should do these things and work towards success. I need to have these things in line. It makes success. But my life, I'm winging it. You don't have a plan for the rest of it. Yeah, right. There's not, there's nobody in all of your strategy, exactly that. And that's, that's where I think it's, it's beautiful, because we do go through life because we can, right, we, we're forced from all these outside forces to, you know, get some structure to our businesses, but maybe we're not forced to on our on our lives. So I love, I love the bridge. I love the idea of that, yeah, I I hope that, you know, I know we've kind of strayed, for folks with the, you know, this concept of leadership, but I think for me, it just, it's such a through line, and that's why I love the topic. I love this concept that you put together. And it's just, it's so important again, from the very beginning, that ownership, that self leadership aspect to your interactions all along the way, whether it's your co workers, your employees, somebody you talk to at the grocery store, there's, there's an aspect of intentionality that comes with embracing this idea of leadership that I absolutely love. So I appreciate you both being here to talk through this. How do, how do we reach out? How do we and why? Right? Who's out there like I gotta. Okay, I'm on board with this. Yeah, I got to talk to Marnie and Nick. Who is that person the most out there that you're really looking to reach and get in front of right now?

Nick Coniglio  40:13  
Well, I would say, you know, the people that have resonated most with us are the people that kind of feel stuck, I think, I think, and it's, it's, it runs the gamut across, you know, every different type of of of person out there. Our passion with our latest project, you know, we're very much geared when we talk about the business of you. We're very much geared towards the younger, younger adults, like high school and college students, but for lead a light class. So I think it applies to everybody. If you're if you've just feel like you need to, you need something. You need that little cheat code to to start to defeat the blank page and progress forward. What we hear from everybody is that that this, this is a really great resource, and we'd love for people to reach out to us. You can find us at lead. It like lasso.com. And all of our social handles are at lead. It like lasso everywhere. We engage with anybody and everybody that that that we can and we love hearing stories, and we love to learn. So we invite anybody who's listening to to either reach out to us on LinkedIn. You can find us morning Stockman Nick can iglio or lead it like class. So anywhere,

Marnie Stockman  41:42  
when Nick said while my internet was out,

Jason Croft  41:46  
perfect, that's awesome. Thank you both for being here and doing what you're doing in the world and making this idea of leadership so accessible to so many more people. And I

Speaker 1  42:01  
just love it. Love what you're doing. Jason, we can't thank you enough for having us, for having us.

Jason Croft  42:06  
Yes, of course, we'll see you all next time. Thanks for joining us on strategy in action. Remember, true industry leaders don't chase opportunities. They attract them. Want to build your own market gravity? Visit media leads, co.com See you next time you.